Discussion:
A Friends Personal Introspective Into a Recent Deer Accident
(too old to reply)
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-07 23:53:42 UTC
Permalink
I had mentioned a couple of times a friend of mine and his wife had an
animal impact accident in Vermont last summer. I know Bob (6ft6) has
been wrestling with the question of will he, or should he ever ride
again. Today Bob posted the following to a local forum. It is an
interesting read.

******************
6ft6
The last “real thing” I remember on August 21, 2010 was that it was a
nice morning, not too warm, not too cool, and we were filling up the gas
tank on our Harley Davidson motorcycle in a little town called Gorham,
Vermont. We had spent the previous night in Farmington, Maine we were
thoroughly enjoying the morning cruising through the countryside.
Apparently we stopped again in Wells River, Vermont (60 miles down the
road) and topped off the tank again, but I do not remember it.

I said “real thing” because I also recall many strange things in the
days that followed, like the ability to control others with my thoughts,
the ability to fly around in an air inflated device that was the size
and shape of a top-loading clothes dryer. Probably one of the scariest
things was being paralyzed and left completely helpless on the landing
of a staircase at night; although waking up chained to the bed in a
derelict building was not a pleasant event either. These are a few of
the “strange” things that I recall, and they are actually more vivid in
my memory than the “real” things. There is no feeling in the world like
being completely paralyzed and carted around in the back of an old car,
only to be dumped on a dirty mattress in an old farm building while your
wife visits with the farmer, and arranges with him to construct a bed
for you out of steel plate.

If the things that I just spoke of in the last paragraph sound a bit
weird, then you just may have a slight inkling of what it is like to
spend 3 weeks in a drug induced state of what I can only describe as
“surreal consciousness”. Welcome to the world of accident recovery,
brought on by being “blindsided” by a deer while you are travelling on
your motorcycle at 65 miles per hour down an Interstate highway.

It seems that is what happened to my wife and I shortly after leaving
Wells River. I have no recollection, none. I remember nothing about
what was actually happening to and around me from basically 1½ hours
prior to this until 19 days later when I was released from hospital in
my home town, on the opposite side of the continent from where I “left
off”. Oh sure, I have small bits of memory regarding a few events, but
none of them line up chronologically or even logically with the real
world. That accident happened approximately four months ago, and over
those four months I have had a lot of time to reflect on my life.

Perhaps the best way to explain this is to talk first about our injuries.

My wife sustained severe abrasions to both of her hands, multiple
bruises on her body and a sprained ankle. She was treated in hospital
and released. The damage to her hands was severe enough that four months
later, her hands are still extremely sensitive to hot & cold and to
touch. Every time I see the scars on her hands, I still feel like being
ill, and come very close to crying…

I received a hematoma on my right arm and a very large edema on my right
hip. I also received a 6 inch long vertical tear in my forehead above my
right eye, a 4 inch long horizontal tear branching off of the six inch
one over my right eye a large edema on my head, multiple complex
lacerations to about 16 square inches of my scalp, a cracked nose, and
a dislocated jaw. When my jaw dislocated, it produced a large blood
blister on my lip and severe bruising of my tongue, as well as
fracturing one of my molars. It seems the impact to my head was severe
enough that the viscous lining in my right eye separated from the
retina, causing an air bubble and I am still experiencing some
‘blurriness” in my vision. My “C3” vertebrae was fractured (this is
known as “the hangman’s break” because this is also the normal result of
being hanged – and is usually fatal) I received fractures to 3 of my “T”
vertebrae – T2, T5 & T6. I also received a fracture to rib 1 on my left
side and to ribs 2 through 8 on my right side. My right lung was
punctured. Again, the impact of the accident was so severe that it also
produced both a pulmonary contusion and cardiac contusion. I was on
life support, and apparently very nearly died.
I am writing this 139 days after the accident and just 31 days after
getting out of a Cervical Collar; I still have a large edema on my right
hip; My feet still swell if I sit without them elevated for any length
of time and I still cannot lie down to sleep at night (I sleep sitting
up in a chair). I still have some vertigo. Even though I take a
relatively large dose of Morphine when I retire, the pain in my hips and
legs wake me up 3 or 4 times a night.

Don’t misunderstand me, I am not looking for sympathy: I knew (or at
least thought I knew) the risk I was taking getting onto a motorcycle.

So why do I go into so much depth describing these injuries?
Because I have to ask myself a very simple, yet important question:
“Could I live with myself if my wife and I were in the opposite roles,
and it was her who received the injuries I did?” After months of what
can only be described as “an emotional roller coaster ride” and mulling
this over again and again in my mind the answer is: “No, I love her way
too much to ever be able to deal with the guilt I would feel if
something like this ever happened to her”.

So, if I want to continue to travel with my wife (which I do) , and I am
not willing to put my wife to this risk again ( which I am not) then I
have to be very realistic about this when asking myself, “Will we ride
again?”
At this point it appears to me that the only answer to this question is:
“No”.

I will miss riding, a lot. I will miss the outings with our “Biker”
friends, a lot. But in life we have to make choices, and we have to
consider many things. It is interesting (at least to me) that I called
our Harley “Choices”;

I never for one moment thought that this would be one of the “Choices”
it would force me to make…
****************

My sense is this is one of the more revealing personal accounts of a
serious accident, a near death experience I have ever read. Bob lived
for riding. He is one of the good guys. Last time I saw him he shook my
hand thanking me for helping to set up our High River camp out. He told
me he and his wife would be back next year. From High River they left
for their cross country ride. The ride which ended in the accident
described above.

Although I never got to know Bob Nixon very well, I recall the
discussions in Reeky when he had his deer accident. If memory serves he
was on the edge for quite a while and suffered through a very long
recovery period. Of course he never fully regained his former health or
vigour. His mildly acidic personality seems to have survived though. ;-)
As we all know Bob did get back on a bike and he continues to ride. If
you read this Bob, I would be interested to know if you had similar
thoughts as 6ft6 did before you got back on the horse?

And we have been following the challenges Thumper has faced since his
accident. Paul, I would also like to know your take on 6ft6's decision.

Now I don't like to dwell too much on accidents. As 6ft6 noted, "We all
know the risks." I even recall Bob saying the exact same thing shortly
after a friend of mine was carted off in an ambulance after driving his
bike into a rock wall. I now have a better understanding of the risks.

So trying hard not to dwell on the prospect of having a bike accident,
we should recognize these are life changing moments. I know I can't ride
thinking of the possibility of having an accident, but when the snow
melts I think I will focus a little more on riding aware and riding safe.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
BryanUT
2011-01-08 00:25:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
I had mentioned a couple of times a friend of mine and his wife had an
animal impact accident in Vermont last summer.  I know Bob (6ft6) has
been wrestling with the question of will he, or should he ever ride
again. Today Bob posted the following to a local forum. It is an
interesting read.
******************
6ft6
The last real thing I remember on August 21, 2010 was that it was a
nice morning, not too warm, not too cool, and we were filling up the gas
tank on our Harley Davidson motorcycle in a little town called Gorham,
Vermont. We had spent the previous night in Farmington, Maine we were
thoroughly enjoying the morning cruising through the countryside.
Apparently we stopped again in Wells River, Vermont (60 miles down the
road) and topped off the tank again, but I do not remember it.
I said real thing because I also recall many strange things in the
days that followed, like the ability to control others with my thoughts,
the ability to fly around in an air inflated device that was the size
and shape of a top-loading clothes dryer. Probably one of the scariest
things was being paralyzed and left completely helpless on the landing
of a staircase at night; although waking up chained to the bed in a
derelict building was not a pleasant event either. These are a few of
the strange things that I recall, and they are actually more vivid in
my memory than the real things. There is no feeling in the world like
being completely paralyzed and carted around in the back of an old car,
only to be dumped on a dirty mattress in an old farm building while your
wife visits with the farmer, and arranges with him to construct a bed
for you out of steel plate.
If the things that I just spoke of in the last paragraph sound a bit
weird, then you just may have a slight inkling of what it is like to
spend 3 weeks in a drug induced state of what I can only describe as
surreal consciousness .   Welcome to the world of accident recovery,
brought on by being blindsided by a deer while you are travelling on
your motorcycle at 65 miles per hour down an Interstate highway.
It seems that is what happened to my wife and I shortly after leaving
Wells River.  I have no recollection, none. I remember nothing about
what was actually happening to and around me from basically 1 hours
prior to this until 19 days later when I was released from hospital in
my home town, on the opposite side of the continent from where I left
off . Oh sure, I have small bits of memory regarding a few events, but
none of them line up chronologically or even logically with the real
world.  That accident happened approximately four months ago, and over
those four months I have had a lot of time to reflect on my life.
Perhaps the best way to explain this is to talk first about our injuries.
My wife sustained severe abrasions to both of her hands, multiple
bruises on her body and a sprained ankle. She was treated in hospital
and released. The damage to her hands was severe enough that four months
later, her hands are still extremely sensitive to hot & cold and to
touch. Every time I see the scars on her hands, I still feel like being
ill, and come very close to crying
I received a hematoma on my right arm and a very large edema on my right
hip. I also received a 6 inch long vertical tear in my forehead above my
right eye, a 4 inch long horizontal tear branching off of the six inch
one over my right eye a large edema on my head, multiple complex
lacerations to about 16 square inches of my scalp, a cracked nose, and
a dislocated jaw. When my jaw dislocated, it produced a large blood
blister on my lip and severe bruising of my tongue, as well as
fracturing one of my molars. It seems the impact to my head was severe
enough that the viscous lining in my right eye separated from the
retina, causing an air bubble and I am still experiencing some
blurriness in my vision.  My C3 vertebrae was fractured (this is
known as the hangman s break because this is also the normal result of
being hanged and is usually fatal) I received fractures to 3 of my T
vertebrae T2, T5 & T6.  I also received a fracture to rib 1 on my left
side and to ribs 2 through 8 on my right side. My right lung was
punctured.  Again, the impact of the accident was so severe that it also
produced both a pulmonary contusion and cardiac contusion.  I was on
life support, and apparently very nearly died.
I am writing this 139 days after the accident and just 31 days after
getting out of a Cervical Collar; I still have a large edema on my right
hip; My feet still swell if I sit without them elevated for any length
of time and I still cannot lie down to sleep at night (I sleep sitting
up in a chair).  I still have some vertigo. Even though I take a
relatively large dose of Morphine when I retire, the pain in my hips and
legs wake me up 3 or 4 times a night.
  Don t misunderstand me, I am not looking for sympathy: I knew (or at
least thought I knew) the risk I was taking getting onto a motorcycle.
So why do I go into so much depth describing these injuries?
Could I live with myself if my wife and I were in the opposite roles,
and it was her who received the injuries I did?  After months of what
can only be described as an emotional roller coaster ride and mulling
this over again and again in my mind the answer is: No, I love her way
too much to ever be able to deal with the guilt I would feel if
something like this ever happened to her .
So, if I want to continue to travel with my wife (which I do) , and I am
not willing to put my wife to this risk again ( which I am not) then I
have to be very realistic about this when asking myself, Will we ride
again?
No .
I will miss riding, a lot. I will miss the outings with our Biker
friends, a lot.  But in life we have to make choices, and we have to
consider many things. It is interesting (at least to me) that I called
our Harley Choices ;
  I never for one moment thought that this would be one of the Choices
it would force me to make
****************
My sense is this is one of the more revealing personal accounts of a
serious accident, a near death experience I have ever read. Bob lived
for riding. He is one of the good guys. Last time I saw him he shook my
hand thanking me for helping to set up our High River camp out.  He told
me he and his wife would be back next year. From High River they left
for their cross country ride. The ride which ended in the accident
described above.
Although I never got to know Bob Nixon very well, I recall the
discussions in Reeky when he had his deer accident.  If memory serves he
was on the edge for quite a while and suffered through a very long
recovery period. Of course he never fully regained his former health or
vigour. His mildly acidic personality seems to have survived though. ;-)
As we all know Bob did get back on a bike and he continues to ride. If
you read this Bob, I would be interested to know if you had similar
thoughts as 6ft6 did before you got back on the horse?
And we have been following the challenges Thumper has faced since his
accident. Paul, I would also like to know your take on 6ft6's decision.
Now I don't like to dwell too much on accidents.  As 6ft6 noted, "We all
know the risks."  I even recall Bob saying the exact same thing shortly
after a friend of mine was carted off in an ambulance after driving his
bike into a rock wall. I now have a better understanding of the risks.
So trying hard not to dwell on the prospect of having a bike accident,
we should recognize these are life changing moments. I know I can't ride
thinking of the possibility of having an accident, but when the snow
melts I think I will focus a little more on riding aware and riding safe.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockieshttp://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Nice post Don.

Life is full of risks. The day I rode my first mountain bike race (in
which I broke a rib) my niece's roommate rode his first downhill
mountain bike race in Idaho. We called him Mike King Crash King. He
crashed and at the tender age of 24 was paralyzed, he has since
passed. In my last mountain bike race I broke my $1700 bike and my
back. I no longer ride mountain bikes, but not due to the injuries.

I've never crashed my road bike, I suspect my first crash would be my
last, I know I'd probably never ride again. But my love of motorcycles
and mountain bikes would continue. I'd probably have some kind of bike
that I could go stare at and sit on, start and listen to the sweet
sound and smell the sweet smell, just to remember the good times.

Bob N. is special. I've ridden with him, he rides like a teenager. I
love him for it.
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-08 04:24:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by BryanUT
Nice post Don.
Thanks Bryan. I thought about it several times before I hit the send
button. I am not partial to people posting about every accident they see
or hear about. In this case I felt 6ft6's perspective was unique, one
that had not been posted to Reeky before.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Bob Nixon
2011-01-12 01:15:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by BryanUT
Post by Calgary (Don)
I had mentioned a couple of times a friend of mine and his wife had an
animal impact accident in Vermont last summer.  I know Bob (6ft6) has
been wrestling with the question of will he, or should he ever ride
again. Today Bob posted the following to a local forum. It is an
interesting read.
******************
6ft6
The last real thing I remember on August 21, 2010 was that it was a
nice morning, not too warm, not too cool, and we were filling up the gas
tank on our Harley Davidson motorcycle in a little town called Gorham,
Vermont. We had spent the previous night in Farmington, Maine we were
thoroughly enjoying the morning cruising through the countryside.
Apparently we stopped again in Wells River, Vermont (60 miles down the
road) and topped off the tank again, but I do not remember it.
I said real thing because I also recall many strange things in the
days that followed, like the ability to control others with my thoughts,
the ability to fly around in an air inflated device that was the size
and shape of a top-loading clothes dryer. Probably one of the scariest
things was being paralyzed and left completely helpless on the landing
of a staircase at night; although waking up chained to the bed in a
derelict building was not a pleasant event either. These are a few of
the strange things that I recall, and they are actually more vivid in
my memory than the real things. There is no feeling in the world like
being completely paralyzed and carted around in the back of an old car,
only to be dumped on a dirty mattress in an old farm building while your
wife visits with the farmer, and arranges with him to construct a bed
for you out of steel plate.
If the things that I just spoke of in the last paragraph sound a bit
weird, then you just may have a slight inkling of what it is like to
spend 3 weeks in a drug induced state of what I can only describe as
surreal consciousness .   Welcome to the world of accident recovery,
brought on by being blindsided by a deer while you are travelling on
your motorcycle at 65 miles per hour down an Interstate highway.
It seems that is what happened to my wife and I shortly after leaving
Wells River.  I have no recollection, none. I remember nothing about
what was actually happening to and around me from basically 1 hours
prior to this until 19 days later when I was released from hospital in
my home town, on the opposite side of the continent from where I left
off . Oh sure, I have small bits of memory regarding a few events, but
none of them line up chronologically or even logically with the real
world.  That accident happened approximately four months ago, and over
those four months I have had a lot of time to reflect on my life.
Perhaps the best way to explain this is to talk first about our injuries.
My wife sustained severe abrasions to both of her hands, multiple
bruises on her body and a sprained ankle. She was treated in hospital
and released. The damage to her hands was severe enough that four months
later, her hands are still extremely sensitive to hot & cold and to
touch. Every time I see the scars on her hands, I still feel like being
ill, and come very close to crying
I received a hematoma on my right arm and a very large edema on my right
hip. I also received a 6 inch long vertical tear in my forehead above my
right eye, a 4 inch long horizontal tear branching off of the six inch
one over my right eye a large edema on my head, multiple complex
lacerations to about 16 square inches of my scalp, a cracked nose, and
a dislocated jaw. When my jaw dislocated, it produced a large blood
blister on my lip and severe bruising of my tongue, as well as
fracturing one of my molars. It seems the impact to my head was severe
enough that the viscous lining in my right eye separated from the
retina, causing an air bubble and I am still experiencing some
blurriness in my vision.  My C3 vertebrae was fractured (this is
known as the hangman s break because this is also the normal result of
being hanged and is usually fatal) I received fractures to 3 of my T
vertebrae T2, T5 & T6.  I also received a fracture to rib 1 on my left
side and to ribs 2 through 8 on my right side. My right lung was
punctured.  Again, the impact of the accident was so severe that it also
produced both a pulmonary contusion and cardiac contusion.  I was on
life support, and apparently very nearly died.
I am writing this 139 days after the accident and just 31 days after
getting out of a Cervical Collar; I still have a large edema on my right
hip; My feet still swell if I sit without them elevated for any length
of time and I still cannot lie down to sleep at night (I sleep sitting
up in a chair).  I still have some vertigo. Even though I take a
relatively large dose of Morphine when I retire, the pain in my hips and
legs wake me up 3 or 4 times a night.
  Don t misunderstand me, I am not looking for sympathy: I knew (or at
least thought I knew) the risk I was taking getting onto a motorcycle.
So why do I go into so much depth describing these injuries?
Could I live with myself if my wife and I were in the opposite roles,
and it was her who received the injuries I did?  After months of what
can only be described as an emotional roller coaster ride and mulling
this over again and again in my mind the answer is: No, I love her way
too much to ever be able to deal with the guilt I would feel if
something like this ever happened to her .
So, if I want to continue to travel with my wife (which I do) , and I am
not willing to put my wife to this risk again ( which I am not) then I
have to be very realistic about this when asking myself, Will we ride
again?
No .
I will miss riding, a lot. I will miss the outings with our Biker
friends, a lot.  But in life we have to make choices, and we have to
consider many things. It is interesting (at least to me) that I called
our Harley Choices ;
  I never for one moment thought that this would be one of the Choices
it would force me to make
****************
My sense is this is one of the more revealing personal accounts of a
serious accident, a near death experience I have ever read. Bob lived
for riding. He is one of the good guys. Last time I saw him he shook my
hand thanking me for helping to set up our High River camp out.  He told
me he and his wife would be back next year. From High River they left
for their cross country ride. The ride which ended in the accident
described above.
Although I never got to know Bob Nixon very well, I recall the
discussions in Reeky when he had his deer accident.  If memory serves he
was on the edge for quite a while and suffered through a very long
recovery period. Of course he never fully regained his former health or
vigour. His mildly acidic personality seems to have survived though. ;-)
As we all know Bob did get back on a bike and he continues to ride. If
you read this Bob, I would be interested to know if you had similar
thoughts as 6ft6 did before you got back on the horse?
And we have been following the challenges Thumper has faced since his
accident. Paul, I would also like to know your take on 6ft6's decision.
Now I don't like to dwell too much on accidents.  As 6ft6 noted, "We all
know the risks."  I even recall Bob saying the exact same thing shortly
after a friend of mine was carted off in an ambulance after driving his
bike into a rock wall. I now have a better understanding of the risks.
So trying hard not to dwell on the prospect of having a bike accident,
we should recognize these are life changing moments. I know I can't ride
thinking of the possibility of having an accident, but when the snow
melts I think I will focus a little more on riding aware and riding safe.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockieshttp://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Nice post Don.
Life is full of risks.  The day I rode my first mountain bike race (in
which I broke a rib) my niece's roommate rode his first downhill
mountain bike race in Idaho. We called him Mike King Crash King. He
crashed and at the tender age of 24 was paralyzed, he has since
passed. In my last mountain bike race I broke my $1700 bike and my
back. I no longer ride mountain bikes, but not due to the injuries.
I've never crashed my road bike, I suspect my first crash would be my
last, I know I'd probably never ride again. But my love of motorcycles
and mountain bikes would continue. I'd probably have some kind of bike
that I could go stare at and sit on, start and listen to the sweet
sound and smell the sweet smell, just to remember the good times.
Bob N. is special. I've ridden with him, he rides like a teenager. I
love him for it.
For Don and Bryan in particular, I'm very sorry I missed this thread
until it became your typical flame fest. That said, Thanks Bryan for
the compliment. Now for Don, I think this whole deer accident or any
other major life trauma for that matter is more a personal choice as
it's your gut feel about things that makes you either quit or keep
riding. For me, the deer accident was not my 1st major motorcycle
accident. The 1st happened about 26 years earlier 08/1977 to
06/13/2004 when a kid ran a red light and T-boned me crushing my left
leg and breaking my right wrist (both bones) on both and a compound
fracture of the leg which took a full year to heal, including a bone
graft from my hip. The leg was 1" shorter and crocked as an old
walking stick afterward. However, I was back riding before the last
lower leg cast was off using a makeshift shifter. On the deer
accident, I remember the morning before (even took a picture at the
top of the hill) and warned others that there were deer spotted in the
last couple of weeks down near where the collision would happen. I was
busted up so bad that they put me in an induced coma for 5 weeks and
remember nothing of the accident or the most brutal part of the
hospital recovery except the amputation and severe heart attach
associated with my PAD and the amputation clotting and lack of any
blood thinners during that time. Plus the nurses in the hospital were
very slow to see the symptoms (need for nitro and O2 for three days
prior to the event) of my heart attack. Anyway rather than repeat what
I've explained many times online I'll just finish by saying my
justification was my age old age, condition and the remoteness of ever
getting hit by a deer twice in one lifetime. But then I've always
loved riding and it's hard to see myself continuing living without all
that incompasses riding to me, including the social aspect of it.

The one thing I miss though is the inability to continue doing track
days. This is more due to my weak heart than the right lower leg
amputation as the rear brake is not used a whole lot on the short
wheelbase bikes that I ride. Then I can no longer steer with the rear
wheel on asphalt like I used to do on occasion + trail braking at high
speed to stabilize the chassis. But then it's a small sacrifice as
long as the drive to still ride without much fear is still with me. If
I did feel uneasy riding though I would have no compunction on
quitting.

A couple of more things. On my 1st bad accident in 1977 I was just
coming back from the store to get some Rolaids for my acid reflux when
entering a tree obscured intersection 20-30 seconds into the GREEN
without protective gear just a couple of blocks from home but luckily
I received no head injuries or serious abrasions but since that day
I've never ridden a bike without protective gear. At least FF helmet,
boots and gloves and nowadays plus during that deer accident I was
wearing full track leathers and still only ride like that save just a
couple of times with jeans on.Bottom line, it up to the individual and
I did quit smoking after the deer accident-:)

Bob Nixon..
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-12 01:46:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Nixon
For Don and Bryan in particular, I'm very sorry I missed this thread
until it became your typical flame fest. That said, Thanks Bryan for
the compliment. Now for Don, I think this whole deer accident or any
other major life trauma for that matter is more a personal choice as
it's your gut feel about things that makes you either quit or keep
riding. For me, the deer accident was not my 1st major motorcycle
accident. The 1st happened about 26 years earlier 08/1977 to
06/13/2004 when a kid ran a red light and T-boned me crushing my left
leg and breaking my right wrist (both bones) on both and a compound
fracture of the leg which took a full year to heal, including a bone
graft from my hip. The leg was 1" shorter and crocked as an old
walking stick afterward. However, I was back riding before the last
lower leg cast was off using a makeshift shifter. On the deer
accident, I remember the morning before (even took a picture at the
top of the hill) and warned others that there were deer spotted in the
last couple of weeks down near where the collision would happen. I was
busted up so bad that they put me in an induced coma for 5 weeks and
remember nothing of the accident or the most brutal part of the
hospital recovery except the amputation and severe heart attach
associated with my PAD and the amputation clotting and lack of any
blood thinners during that time. Plus the nurses in the hospital were
very slow to see the symptoms (need for nitro and O2 for three days
prior to the event) of my heart attack. Anyway rather than repeat what
I've explained many times online I'll just finish by saying my
justification was my age old age, condition and the remoteness of ever
getting hit by a deer twice in one lifetime. But then I've always
loved riding and it's hard to see myself continuing living without all
that incompasses riding to me, including the social aspect of it.
The one thing I miss though is the inability to continue doing track
days. This is more due to my weak heart than the right lower leg
amputation as the rear brake is not used a whole lot on the short
wheelbase bikes that I ride. Then I can no longer steer with the rear
wheel on asphalt like I used to do on occasion + trail braking at high
speed to stabilize the chassis. But then it's a small sacrifice as
long as the drive to still ride without much fear is still with me. If
I did feel uneasy riding though I would have no compunction on
quitting.
A couple of more things. On my 1st bad accident in 1977 I was just
coming back from the store to get some Rolaids for my acid reflux when
entering a tree obscured intersection 20-30 seconds into the GREEN
without protective gear just a couple of blocks from home but luckily
I received no head injuries or serious abrasions but since that day
I've never ridden a bike without protective gear. At least FF helmet,
boots and gloves and nowadays plus during that deer accident I was
wearing full track leathers and still only ride like that save just a
couple of times with jeans on.Bottom line, it up to the individual and
I did quit smoking after the deer accident-:)
Well you did give up one dangerous habit. <g>

I recall the aftermath of your deer accident. You had many friends in
Reeky who were very concerned for your health. Sunny and I think it was
Debbie [1] who offered daily reports of your challenges and your
triumphs. I recall them telling us several times you were not expected
to live through the night.

Thanks for sharing this. I am sure you are tired of talking about it.
Surviving two major accidents and living to ride again serves to prove
you are one tough old bird.

See ya on the road!


[1] I hope I got the name right. CRS.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
TMack
2011-01-08 01:46:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
I had mentioned a couple of times a friend of mine and his wife had an
animal impact accident in Vermont last summer. I know Bob (6ft6) has
been wrestling with the question of will he, or should he ever ride
again. Today Bob posted the following to a local forum. It is an
interesting read.
******************
6ft6
The last "real thing" I remember on August 21, 2010 was that it was a
SNIP

The two things that immediately occurred to me when reading this were:
1. If he had been wearing a full-face crash helmet he might have avoided
the head injuries.
2. Was his wife wearing proper motorcycle gloves? It doesn't sound like
it, which would explain her abrasion injuries

Motorcycling is inherently risky. Wearing the right kit substantially
reduces the risk.
--
Tony
'04 Ducati ST3, '08 DL650GT,
97 TW200, '87 semi-rat LS650, OMF#24
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-08 04:27:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by TMack
Post by Calgary (Don)
I had mentioned a couple of times a friend of mine and his wife had an
animal impact accident in Vermont last summer. I know Bob (6ft6) has
been wrestling with the question of will he, or should he ever ride
again. Today Bob posted the following to a local forum. It is an
interesting read.
******************
6ft6
The last "real thing" I remember on August 21, 2010 was that it was a
SNIP
1. If he had been wearing a full-face crash helmet he might have avoided
the head injuries.
2. Was his wife wearing proper motorcycle gloves? It doesn't sound like
it, which would explain her abrasion injuries
Yeah, yeah, yeah, woulda, shoulda, coulda and if if and buts were
candies and nuts every day would be Christmas.

We have had that discussion a thousand times. It doesn't lessen the
importance of wearing good gear but having that tired old discussion
again was not the purpose of my post.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
tomorrow@erols.com
2011-01-08 02:21:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
I had mentioned a couple of times a friend of mine and his wife had an
animal impact accident in Vermont last summer.  I know Bob (6ft6) has
been wrestling with the question of will he, or should he ever ride
again. Today Bob posted the following to a local forum. It is an
interesting read.
******************
6ft6
The last real thing I remember on August 21, 2010 was that it was a
nice morning, not too warm, not too cool, and we were filling up the gas
tank on our Harley Davidson motorcycle in a little town called Gorham,
Vermont. We had spent the previous night in Farmington, Maine we were
thoroughly enjoying the morning cruising through the countryside.
Apparently we stopped again in Wells River, Vermont (60 miles down the
road) and topped off the tank again, but I do not remember it.
I said real thing because I also recall many strange things in the
days that followed, like the ability to control others with my thoughts,
the ability to fly around in an air inflated device that was the size
and shape of a top-loading clothes dryer. Probably one of the scariest
things was being paralyzed and left completely helpless on the landing
of a staircase at night; although waking up chained to the bed in a
derelict building was not a pleasant event either. These are a few of
the strange things that I recall, and they are actually more vivid in
my memory than the real things. There is no feeling in the world like
being completely paralyzed and carted around in the back of an old car,
only to be dumped on a dirty mattress in an old farm building while your
wife visits with the farmer, and arranges with him to construct a bed
for you out of steel plate.
If the things that I just spoke of in the last paragraph sound a bit
weird, then you just may have a slight inkling of what it is like to
spend 3 weeks in a drug induced state of what I can only describe as
surreal consciousness .   Welcome to the world of accident recovery,
brought on by being blindsided by a deer while you are travelling on
your motorcycle at 65 miles per hour down an Interstate highway.
It seems that is what happened to my wife and I shortly after leaving
Wells River.  I have no recollection, none. I remember nothing about
what was actually happening to and around me from basically 1 hours
prior to this until 19 days later when I was released from hospital in
my home town, on the opposite side of the continent from where I left
off . Oh sure, I have small bits of memory regarding a few events, but
none of them line up chronologically or even logically with the real
world.  That accident happened approximately four months ago, and over
those four months I have had a lot of time to reflect on my life.
Perhaps the best way to explain this is to talk first about our injuries.
My wife sustained severe abrasions to both of her hands, multiple
bruises on her body and a sprained ankle. She was treated in hospital
and released. The damage to her hands was severe enough that four months
later, her hands are still extremely sensitive to hot & cold and to
touch. Every time I see the scars on her hands, I still feel like being
ill, and come very close to crying
I received a hematoma on my right arm and a very large edema on my right
hip. I also received a 6 inch long vertical tear in my forehead above my
right eye, a 4 inch long horizontal tear branching off of the six inch
one over my right eye a large edema on my head, multiple complex
lacerations to about 16 square inches of my scalp, a cracked nose, and
a dislocated jaw. When my jaw dislocated, it produced a large blood
blister on my lip and severe bruising of my tongue, as well as
fracturing one of my molars. It seems the impact to my head was severe
enough that the viscous lining in my right eye separated from the
retina, causing an air bubble and I am still experiencing some
blurriness in my vision.  My C3 vertebrae was fractured (this is
known as the hangman s break because this is also the normal result of
being hanged and is usually fatal) I received fractures to 3 of my T
vertebrae T2, T5 & T6.  I also received a fracture to rib 1 on my left
side and to ribs 2 through 8 on my right side. My right lung was
punctured.  Again, the impact of the accident was so severe that it also
produced both a pulmonary contusion and cardiac contusion.  I was on
life support, and apparently very nearly died.
I am writing this 139 days after the accident and just 31 days after
getting out of a Cervical Collar; I still have a large edema on my right
hip; My feet still swell if I sit without them elevated for any length
of time and I still cannot lie down to sleep at night (I sleep sitting
up in a chair).  I still have some vertigo. Even though I take a
relatively large dose of Morphine when I retire, the pain in my hips and
legs wake me up 3 or 4 times a night.
  Don t misunderstand me, I am not looking for sympathy: I knew (or at
least thought I knew) the risk I was taking getting onto a motorcycle.
So why do I go into so much depth describing these injuries?
Could I live with myself if my wife and I were in the opposite roles,
and it was her who received the injuries I did?  After months of what
can only be described as an emotional roller coaster ride and mulling
this over again and again in my mind the answer is: No, I love her way
too much to ever be able to deal with the guilt I would feel if
something like this ever happened to her .
So, if I want to continue to travel with my wife (which I do) , and I am
not willing to put my wife to this risk again ( which I am not) then I
have to be very realistic about this when asking myself, Will we ride
again?
No .
I will miss riding, a lot. I will miss the outings with our Biker
friends, a lot.  But in life we have to make choices, and we have to
consider many things. It is interesting (at least to me) that I called
our Harley Choices ;
  I never for one moment thought that this would be one of the Choices
it would force me to make
****************
My sense is this is one of the more revealing personal accounts of a
serious accident, a near death experience I have ever read. Bob lived
for riding. He is one of the good guys. Last time I saw him he shook my
hand thanking me for helping to set up our High River camp out.  He told
me he and his wife would be back next year. From High River they left
for their cross country ride. The ride which ended in the accident
described above.
Although I never got to know Bob Nixon very well, I recall the
discussions in Reeky when he had his deer accident.  If memory serves he
was on the edge for quite a while and suffered through a very long
recovery period. Of course he never fully regained his former health or
vigour. His mildly acidic personality seems to have survived though. ;-)
As we all know Bob did get back on a bike and he continues to ride. If
you read this Bob, I would be interested to know if you had similar
thoughts as 6ft6 did before you got back on the horse?
And we have been following the challenges Thumper has faced since his
accident. Paul, I would also like to know your take on 6ft6's decision.
Now I don't like to dwell too much on accidents.  As 6ft6 noted, "We all
know the risks."  I even recall Bob saying the exact same thing shortly
after a friend of mine was carted off in an ambulance after driving his
bike into a rock wall. I now have a better understanding of the risks.
So trying hard not to dwell on the prospect of having a bike accident,
we should recognize these are life changing moments. I know I can't ride
thinking of the possibility of having an accident, but when the snow
melts I think I will focus a little more on riding aware and riding safe.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockieshttp://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from motorcycle accidents during my 33 years of
riding, your friend's story is a familiar one.

Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.

For me, living without riding would be worthwhile, but would only be
so if I were unable to ride.
saddlebag
2011-01-08 03:29:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@erols.com
Post by Calgary (Don)
I had mentioned a couple of times a friend of mine and his wife had an
animal impact accident in Vermont last summer.  I know Bob (6ft6) has
been wrestling with the question of will he, or should he ever ride
again. Today Bob posted the following to a local forum. It is an
interesting read.
******************
6ft6
The last real thing I remember on August 21, 2010 was that it was a
nice morning, not too warm, not too cool, and we were filling up the gas
tank on our Harley Davidson motorcycle in a little town called Gorham,
Vermont. We had spent the previous night in Farmington, Maine we were
thoroughly enjoying the morning cruising through the countryside.
Apparently we stopped again in Wells River, Vermont (60 miles down the
road) and topped off the tank again, but I do not remember it.
I said real thing because I also recall many strange things in the
days that followed, like the ability to control others with my thoughts,
the ability to fly around in an air inflated device that was the size
and shape of a top-loading clothes dryer. Probably one of the scariest
things was being paralyzed and left completely helpless on the landing
of a staircase at night; although waking up chained to the bed in a
derelict building was not a pleasant event either. These are a few of
the strange things that I recall, and they are actually more vivid in
my memory than the real things. There is no feeling in the world like
being completely paralyzed and carted around in the back of an old car,
only to be dumped on a dirty mattress in an old farm building while your
wife visits with the farmer, and arranges with him to construct a bed
for you out of steel plate.
If the things that I just spoke of in the last paragraph sound a bit
weird, then you just may have a slight inkling of what it is like to
spend 3 weeks in a drug induced state of what I can only describe as
surreal consciousness .   Welcome to the world of accident recovery,
brought on by being blindsided by a deer while you are travelling on
your motorcycle at 65 miles per hour down an Interstate highway.
It seems that is what happened to my wife and I shortly after leaving
Wells River.  I have no recollection, none. I remember nothing about
what was actually happening to and around me from basically 1 hours
prior to this until 19 days later when I was released from hospital in
my home town, on the opposite side of the continent from where I left
off . Oh sure, I have small bits of memory regarding a few events, but
none of them line up chronologically or even logically with the real
world.  That accident happened approximately four months ago, and over
those four months I have had a lot of time to reflect on my life.
Perhaps the best way to explain this is to talk first about our injuries.
My wife sustained severe abrasions to both of her hands, multiple
bruises on her body and a sprained ankle. She was treated in hospital
and released. The damage to her hands was severe enough that four months
later, her hands are still extremely sensitive to hot & cold and to
touch. Every time I see the scars on her hands, I still feel like being
ill, and come very close to crying
I received a hematoma on my right arm and a very large edema on my right
hip. I also received a 6 inch long vertical tear in my forehead above my
right eye, a 4 inch long horizontal tear branching off of the six inch
one over my right eye a large edema on my head, multiple complex
lacerations to about 16 square inches of my scalp, a cracked nose, and
a dislocated jaw. When my jaw dislocated, it produced a large blood
blister on my lip and severe bruising of my tongue, as well as
fracturing one of my molars. It seems the impact to my head was severe
enough that the viscous lining in my right eye separated from the
retina, causing an air bubble and I am still experiencing some
blurriness in my vision.  My C3 vertebrae was fractured (this is
known as the hangman s break because this is also the normal result of
being hanged and is usually fatal) I received fractures to 3 of my T
vertebrae T2, T5 & T6.  I also received a fracture to rib 1 on my left
side and to ribs 2 through 8 on my right side. My right lung was
punctured.  Again, the impact of the accident was so severe that it also
produced both a pulmonary contusion and cardiac contusion.  I was on
life support, and apparently very nearly died.
I am writing this 139 days after the accident and just 31 days after
getting out of a Cervical Collar; I still have a large edema on my right
hip; My feet still swell if I sit without them elevated for any length
of time and I still cannot lie down to sleep at night (I sleep sitting
up in a chair).  I still have some vertigo. Even though I take a
relatively large dose of Morphine when I retire, the pain in my hips and
legs wake me up 3 or 4 times a night.
  Don t misunderstand me, I am not looking for sympathy: I knew (or at
least thought I knew) the risk I was taking getting onto a motorcycle.
So why do I go into so much depth describing these injuries?
Could I live with myself if my wife and I were in the opposite roles,
and it was her who received the injuries I did?  After months of what
can only be described as an emotional roller coaster ride and mulling
this over again and again in my mind the answer is: No, I love her way
too much to ever be able to deal with the guilt I would feel if
something like this ever happened to her .
So, if I want to continue to travel with my wife (which I do) , and I am
not willing to put my wife to this risk again ( which I am not) then I
have to be very realistic about this when asking myself, Will we ride
again?
No .
I will miss riding, a lot. I will miss the outings with our Biker
friends, a lot.  But in life we have to make choices, and we have to
consider many things. It is interesting (at least to me) that I called
our Harley Choices ;
  I never for one moment thought that this would be one of the Choices
it would force me to make
****************
My sense is this is one of the more revealing personal accounts of a
serious accident, a near death experience I have ever read. Bob lived
for riding. He is one of the good guys. Last time I saw him he shook my
hand thanking me for helping to set up our High River camp out.  He told
me he and his wife would be back next year. From High River they left
for their cross country ride. The ride which ended in the accident
described above.
Although I never got to know Bob Nixon very well, I recall the
discussions in Reeky when he had his deer accident.  If memory serves he
was on the edge for quite a while and suffered through a very long
recovery period. Of course he never fully regained his former health or
vigour. His mildly acidic personality seems to have survived though. ;-)
As we all know Bob did get back on a bike and he continues to ride. If
you read this Bob, I would be interested to know if you had similar
thoughts as 6ft6 did before you got back on the horse?
And we have been following the challenges Thumper has faced since his
accident. Paul, I would also like to know your take on 6ft6's decision.
Now I don't like to dwell too much on accidents.  As 6ft6 noted, "We all
know the risks."  I even recall Bob saying the exact same thing shortly
after a friend of mine was carted off in an ambulance after driving his
bike into a rock wall. I now have a better understanding of the risks.
So trying hard not to dwell on the prospect of having a bike accident,
we should recognize these are life changing moments. I know I can't ride
thinking of the possibility of having an accident, but when the snow
melts I think I will focus a little more on riding aware and riding safe.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockieshttp://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from motorcycle accidents during my 33 years of
riding, your friend's story is a familiar one.
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
For me, living without riding would be worthwhile
Gawd I would hope so...if it weren't for me I'd have to kill myself
every December!
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-08 04:35:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from motorcycle accidents during my 33 years of
riding, your friend's story is a familiar one.
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
For me, living without riding would be worthwhile, but would only be
so if I were unable to ride.
I feel much the same as you do Tim. Over Christmas I was chatting with
my sister about riding and she remarked motorcycle riding was a part of
me and defined who I am. She might be right.

I had a bit of a health problem a couple of months back that could have
terminated my ability to ride on two wheels. It's all good now, but it
was a sobering feeling thinking my riding days might be over. I am not
sure I would enjoy riding a trike or a Spyder.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Road Glidin' Don
2011-01-08 20:08:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
I had a bit of a health problem a couple of months back that could have
terminated my ability to ride on two wheels. It's all good now, but it
was a sobering feeling thinking my riding days might be over. I am not
sure I would enjoy riding a trike or a Spyder.
Glad to hear you made it okay. Things like that do make one think
though, don't they?
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-08 20:19:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Road Glidin' Don
Post by Calgary (Don)
I had a bit of a health problem a couple of months back that could have
terminated my ability to ride on two wheels. It's all good now, but it
was a sobering feeling thinking my riding days might be over. I am not
sure I would enjoy riding a trike or a Spyder.
Glad to hear you made it okay. Things like that do make one think
though, don't they?
Up to a certain point in our lives, we all think we are immortal.
Realizing we are not can be a bit of an eye opener.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
The Older Gentleman
2011-01-08 16:44:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.

Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?

Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?

Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Triumph Street Triple Honda CB400F
Suzuki TS250 Suzuki GN250 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing damages a machine more than an ignoramus with a manual, a
can-do attitude and a set of cheap tools
schwarzesonne
2011-01-08 17:32:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
I suppose that none of your pikey friends has ever stopped fucking
hedgehogs after an unpleasant experience...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Road Glidin' Don
2011-01-08 19:45:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
Good to hear you acknowledge that. Self awareness is the first step
to recovery.
schwarzesonne
2011-01-08 20:24:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
Good to hear you acknowledge that.  Self awareness is the first step
to recovery.
No, *self* awareness is the beginning of *suffering* and Self
Awareness is the end of suffering.

IOW, aham brahmasmi...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Beav
2011-01-10 12:48:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by The Older Gentleman
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
I suppose that none of your pikey friends has ever stopped fucking
hedgehogs after an unpleasant experience...
What, like reading just one of your posts?
--
Beav
schwarzesonne
2011-01-10 20:47:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beav
Post by schwarzesonne
I suppose that none of your pikey friends has ever stopped fucking
hedgehogs after an unpleasant experience...
What, like reading just one of your posts?
So, is that a tacit admission the Limeys enjoy fucking hedgehogs, or
what?

Would you like to tell us about your first experience with a hedgehog?

Like, was it awake, or asleep? Did you have to slip drugs in its drink
or what?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an idiot with an attitude, is a
week behind the threads, and feels *obliged* to catch up by answering
a bunch of posts that nobody else gives a shit about, unless it's Neil
"Two Blankets" Murray
who is an egomaniac with an attitude, an agenda, a keyboard and lots
of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-08 19:56:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?
Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
Did anyone say they would?
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Beav
2011-01-10 12:52:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?
Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
Did anyone say they would?
Lots of people assume that if you have a bike accident, then getting back on
a bike makes you a fucking lunatic and they invariably suggest that you stop
riding because it's "Not A Good Thing". When they're presented with the
options that Tog posted, some of them see things from a different
perspective, but initially the reaction is always "Are you riding AGAIN?,
you must be mad"

But of course, you know that already.
--
Beav
The Older Gentleman
2011-01-10 20:20:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beav
Lots of people assume that if you have a bike accident, then getting back on
a bike makes you a fucking lunatic and they invariably suggest that you stop
riding because it's "Not A Good Thing". When they're presented with the
options that Tog posted, some of them see things from a different
perspective, but initially the reaction is always "Are you riding AGAIN?,
you must be mad"
But of course, you know that already.
He's simply misunderstood. Again. Been quiet for a while, but the winter
air has obviously done something.
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Triumph Street Triple Honda CB400F
Suzuki TS250 Suzuki GN250 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing damages a machine more than an ignoramus with a manual, a
can-do attitude and a set of cheap tools
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-10 23:38:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beav
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?
Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
Did anyone say they would?
Lots of people assume that if you have a bike accident, then getting
back on a bike makes you a fucking lunatic and they invariably suggest
that you stop riding because it's "Not A Good Thing". When they're
presented with the options that Tog posted, some of them see things from
a different perspective, but initially the reaction is always "Are you
riding AGAIN?, you must be mad"
But of course, you know that already.
The fact some people think we are mad for riding bikes period doesn't
make Neil's comment relevant to this discussion. I didn't read where
anyone suggested we should give up riding due to someone else getting
into an accident. I I missed it, my apologies.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Mark Olson
2011-01-11 00:47:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beav
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?
Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
Did anyone say they would?
Lots of people assume that if you have a bike accident, then getting
back on a bike makes you a fucking lunatic and they invariably suggest
that you stop riding because it's "Not A Good Thing". When they're
presented with the options that Tog posted, some of them see things from
a different perspective, but initially the reaction is always "Are you
riding AGAIN?, you must be mad"
But of course, you know that already.
The fact some people think we are mad for riding bikes period doesn't make Neil's comment relevant to this discussion. I didn't read where anyone suggested we should give up riding due to someone else getting into an accident. I I missed it, my apologies.
I don't think anyone here suggested it, but it was pretty natural to bring
it up as a followup to your posting, as anyone who has ridden for any length
of time has no doubt experienced the same sort of thing.

For instance, my sister never misses an opportunity to bring up a fatal bike
accident that she and her husband (an EMT) witnessed while they were at a
restaurant. Since he was first on the scene he had to jump in and render aid.
It's her way of justifying her well-meaning but misdirected attempts to get
me to see the error of my ways. To most of the non-riding public were are
crazy to be riding in the first place, and lots of them just cannot understand
why we don't wise up, do the sensible thing, and stop riding immediately.

Maybe it's similar for the anti-bike crowd the way it is for how some people
react to smokers- why don't they just wise up and quit, since it's surely
going to get them in the end? There's little difference in their minds between
the near certainty of illness or death from smoking and riding bikes. The
difference as I see it, is that at least riding bikes is something I enjoy
greatly, which is definitely not something I would say about smoking. And I
may be fooling myself but I think there is a chance I may survive my bike
riding. Knock on wood.
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-11 01:49:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Olson
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by Beav
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?
Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
Did anyone say they would?
Lots of people assume that if you have a bike accident, then getting
back on a bike makes you a fucking lunatic and they invariably suggest
that you stop riding because it's "Not A Good Thing". When they're
presented with the options that Tog posted, some of them see things from
a different perspective, but initially the reaction is always "Are you
riding AGAIN?, you must be mad"
But of course, you know that already.
The fact some people think we are mad for riding bikes period doesn't
make Neil's comment relevant to this discussion. I didn't read where
anyone suggested we should give up riding due to someone else getting
into an accident. I I missed it, my apologies.
I don't think anyone here suggested it, but it was pretty natural to bring
it up as a followup to your posting, as anyone who has ridden for any length
of time has no doubt experienced the same sort of thing.
For instance, my sister never misses an opportunity to bring up a fatal bike
accident that she and her husband (an EMT) witnessed while they were at a
restaurant. Since he was first on the scene he had to jump in and render
aid.
It's her way of justifying her well-meaning but misdirected attempts to get
me to see the error of my ways. To most of the non-riding public were are
crazy to be riding in the first place, and lots of them just cannot understand
why we don't wise up, do the sensible thing, and stop riding immediately.
Maybe it's similar for the anti-bike crowd the way it is for how some people
react to smokers- why don't they just wise up and quit, since it's surely
going to get them in the end? There's little difference in their minds
between
the near certainty of illness or death from smoking and riding bikes. The
difference as I see it, is that at least riding bikes is something I enjoy
greatly, which is definitely not something I would say about smoking. And I
may be fooling myself but I think there is a chance I may survive my bike
riding. Knock on wood.
I get that Mark. Never said I didn't. I merely mentioned no one said
they were considering giving up riding because someone else got into an
accident.

I also get that Neil was responding to Tim's message where he touched on
continuing to drive and ride despite knowing people who have died in
accidents.

With all due respect neither comment was germane to the original post.

I hear what you are saying of it being a logical follow up and that is
fair. My friend 6 ft 6 made his own decision based on a personal
experience. Until we walk a mile in his shoes we really don't know
whether we would make the same decision he did, or take the route Bob
Nixon did. I respect both men and the decisions they made. I do not know
what I would do if I had gone through what they did. I pray I will never
have to face that decision.

As for the Nanny Staters, well they are all around us, trying to force
everyone to live by their code, be it oppressive taxes to encourage us
to drive a car of their choice or by labelling us mad for taking part in
a dangerous activity such as motorcycling.

I too hope I will survive my desire to ride bikes and I will do all in
my power to be a better rider tomorrow than I am today, but the
potential dire result is not something I dwell on.

Just yesterday I bought another of David Houghs books and I am looking
forward to reading it as this dreary winter drags on. I am sure by the
time I get to the last page I will have a better understanding of riding
technique and potentially be a more accomplished rider.

By the way I was a three pack a day guy for the better part of
twenty-five years and I did enjoy smoking. <g> I have also enjoyed the
last twenty years free of the addiction.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Mark Olson
2011-01-11 02:58:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
With all due respect neither comment was germane to the original post.
Good thing that isn't a requirement for posting here. The fact is that
when something is posted, the probability of the thread staying on topic
is practically zero as time goes on. This thread is no different.
Post by Calgary (Don)
I hear what you are saying of it being a logical follow up and that is
fair. My friend 6 ft 6 made his own decision based on a personal
experience. Until we walk a mile in his shoes we really don't know
whether we would make the same decision he did, or take the route Bob
Nixon did. I respect both men and the decisions they made. I do not know
what I would do if I had gone through what they did. I pray I will never
have to face that decision.
As I also do, but in fact, your friend's decision on whether to ride or
not really had nothing to do with what I (or TOG or Tim for that matter) posted.
That story, as compelling and thought-provoking as it was, deserves to be
discussed, but other than serving as a convenient starting point for a
discussion of how non-motorcyclist perceive us and assess our sanity, it
had little relevance to what I posted. Not that I am being disrespectful
to your friends, but as I said before, thread swerve is the main mode of
this and most other newsgroups, and has to be accepted for what it is.
Post by Calgary (Don)
As for the Nanny Staters, well they are all around us, trying to force
everyone to live by their code, be it oppressive taxes to encourage us
to drive a car of their choice or by labelling us mad for taking part in
a dangerous activity such as motorcycling.
I too hope I will survive my desire to ride bikes and I will do all in
my power to be a better rider tomorrow than I am today, but the
potential dire result is not something I dwell on.
Just yesterday I bought another of David Houghs books and I am looking
forward to reading it as this dreary winter drags on. I am sure by the
time I get to the last page I will have a better understanding of riding
technique and potentially be a more accomplished rider.
Mr.Hough's books are excellent reading and I recommend them to anyone who
wants to improve their riding.
Post by Calgary (Don)
By the way I was a three pack a day guy for the better part of
twenty-five years and I did enjoy smoking. <g> I have also enjoyed the
last twenty years free of the addiction.
No need to clarify that, I was careful to point out only that smoking wasn't
pleasurable for me (thank goodness).
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-11 03:30:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
With all due respect neither comment was germane to the original post.
Good thing that isn't a requirement for posting here. The fact is that
when something is posted, the probability of the thread staying on topic
is practically zero as time goes on. This thread is no different.
Post by Calgary (Don)
I hear what you are saying of it being a logical follow up and that is
fair. My friend 6 ft 6 made his own decision based on a personal
experience. Until we walk a mile in his shoes we really don't know
whether we would make the same decision he did, or take the route Bob
Nixon did. I respect both men and the decisions they made. I do not
know what I would do if I had gone through what they did. I pray I
will never have to face that decision.
As I also do, but in fact, your friend's decision on whether to ride or
not really had nothing to do with what I (or TOG or Tim for that matter) posted.
That story, as compelling and thought-provoking as it was, deserves to be
discussed, but other than serving as a convenient starting point for a
discussion of how non-motorcyclist perceive us and assess our sanity, it
had little relevance to what I posted. Not that I am being disrespectful
to your friends, but as I said before, thread swerve is the main mode of
this and most other newsgroups, and has to be accepted for what it is.
I don't disagree thread swerve has always been the norm around here and
I don't consider it disrespectful to anyone that this thread will veer
from the original post. Personally I am surprised it hasn't degenerated
into the usual BS. I merely pointed out a couple of comments were not
germane to the original post. It wasn't my intent to pass judgment.
Post by Calgary (Don)
As for the Nanny Staters, well they are all around us, trying to force
everyone to live by their code, be it oppressive taxes to encourage us
to drive a car of their choice or by labelling us mad for taking part
in a dangerous activity such as motorcycling.
I too hope I will survive my desire to ride bikes and I will do all in
my power to be a better rider tomorrow than I am today, but the
potential dire result is not something I dwell on.
Just yesterday I bought another of David Houghs books and I am looking
forward to reading it as this dreary winter drags on. I am sure by the
time I get to the last page I will have a better understanding of
riding technique and potentially be a more accomplished rider.
Mr.Hough's books are excellent reading and I recommend them to anyone who
wants to improve their riding.
I have given away Proficient Motorcycling three times now. It is getting
a little expensive to meet new riders. <g>
Post by Calgary (Don)
By the way I was a three pack a day guy for the better part of
twenty-five years and I did enjoy smoking. <g> I have also enjoyed the
last twenty years free of the addiction.
No need to clarify that, I was careful to point out only that smoking wasn't
pleasurable for me (thank goodness).
It is a nasty, expensive habit and a tough one to kick.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
tomorrow@erols.com
2011-01-11 04:42:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by Mark Olson
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by Beav
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?
Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
Did anyone say they would?
Lots of people assume that if you have a bike accident, then getting
back on a bike makes you a fucking lunatic and they invariably suggest
that you stop riding because it's "Not A Good Thing". When they're
presented with the options that Tog posted, some of them see things from
a different perspective, but initially the reaction is always "Are you
riding AGAIN?, you must be mad"
But of course, you know that already.
The fact some people think we are mad for riding bikes period doesn't
make Neil's comment relevant to this discussion. I didn't read where
anyone suggested we should give up riding due to someone else getting
into an accident. I I missed it, my apologies.
I don't think anyone here suggested it, but it was pretty natural to bring
it up as a followup to your posting, as anyone who has ridden for any length
of time has no doubt experienced the same sort of thing.
For instance, my sister never misses an opportunity to bring up a fatal bike
accident that she and her husband (an EMT) witnessed while they were at a
restaurant. Since he was first on the scene he had to jump in and render
aid.
It's her way of justifying her well-meaning but misdirected attempts to get
me to see the error of my ways. To most of the non-riding public were are
crazy to be riding in the first place, and lots of them just cannot understand
why we don't wise up, do the sensible thing, and stop riding immediately.
Maybe it's similar for the anti-bike crowd the way it is for how some people
react to smokers- why don't they just wise up and quit, since it's surely
going to get them in the end? There's little difference in their minds
between
the near certainty of illness or death from smoking and riding bikes. The
difference as I see it, is that at least riding bikes is something I enjoy
greatly, which is definitely not something I would say about smoking. And I
may be fooling myself but I think there is a chance I may survive my bike
riding. Knock on wood.
I get that Mark. Never said I didn't. I merely mentioned no one said
they were considering giving up riding because someone else got into an
accident.
I also get that Neil was responding to Tim's message where he touched on
continuing to drive and ride despite knowing people who have died in
accidents.
With all due respect neither comment was germane to the original post.
I guess I thought mine kind of was. Like your friend, I am a lifelong
motorcyclist. Unlike your friend, I have not been grieveously injured
in a motorcycle accident. However, much like your friend, my brother
and one of my best friends *have* been grieveously injured; in fact,
both of them suffered far greater injuries than your friend.

Both of them went through similar thought processes to those that your
friend discussed in his well-written and thoughtful piece.

Their trials and travails made me think hard about why I ride, and
whether I should continue to ride.

I'm sorry if my reflections on my own personal feelings on the subject
intruded on the thread; but at the time I posted them, I did think
they were germane to the subject that your friend's reflections raised.
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-11 05:15:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@erols.com
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by Mark Olson
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by Beav
Post by Calgary (Don)
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?
Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
Did anyone say they would?
Lots of people assume that if you have a bike accident, then getting
back on a bike makes you a fucking lunatic and they invariably suggest
that you stop riding because it's "Not A Good Thing". When they're
presented with the options that Tog posted, some of them see things from
a different perspective, but initially the reaction is always "Are you
riding AGAIN?, you must be mad"
But of course, you know that already.
The fact some people think we are mad for riding bikes period doesn't
make Neil's comment relevant to this discussion. I didn't read where
anyone suggested we should give up riding due to someone else getting
into an accident. I I missed it, my apologies.
I don't think anyone here suggested it, but it was pretty natural to bring
it up as a followup to your posting, as anyone who has ridden for any length
of time has no doubt experienced the same sort of thing.
For instance, my sister never misses an opportunity to bring up a fatal bike
accident that she and her husband (an EMT) witnessed while they were at a
restaurant. Since he was first on the scene he had to jump in and render
aid.
It's her way of justifying her well-meaning but misdirected attempts to get
me to see the error of my ways. To most of the non-riding public were are
crazy to be riding in the first place, and lots of them just cannot understand
why we don't wise up, do the sensible thing, and stop riding immediately.
Maybe it's similar for the anti-bike crowd the way it is for how some people
react to smokers- why don't they just wise up and quit, since it's surely
going to get them in the end? There's little difference in their minds
between
the near certainty of illness or death from smoking and riding bikes. The
difference as I see it, is that at least riding bikes is something I enjoy
greatly, which is definitely not something I would say about smoking. And I
may be fooling myself but I think there is a chance I may survive my bike
riding. Knock on wood.
I get that Mark. Never said I didn't. I merely mentioned no one said
they were considering giving up riding because someone else got into an
accident.
I also get that Neil was responding to Tim's message where he touched on
continuing to drive and ride despite knowing people who have died in
accidents.
With all due respect neither comment was germane to the original post.
I guess I thought mine kind of was. Like your friend, I am a lifelong
motorcyclist. Unlike your friend, I have not been grieveously injured
in a motorcycle accident. However, much like your friend, my brother
and one of my best friends *have* been grieveously injured; in fact,
both of them suffered far greater injuries than your friend.
That`s rough. I hope they have recovered.
Post by ***@erols.com
Both of them went through similar thought processes to those that your
friend discussed in his well-written and thoughtful piece.
Their trials and travails made me think hard about why I ride, and
whether I should continue to ride.
I'm sorry if my reflections on my own personal feelings on the subject
intruded on the thread; but at the time I posted them, I did think
they were germane to the subject that your friend's reflections raised.
It's no big deal Tim. I feel exactly the same way you do. You can`t
ride for the years we have without having friends get killed or
seriously hurt on the road. It is a risk we all take. After reading
6ft6`s piece I think I understand the impact of the risk a little
better. I still enjoy riding and look forward to another terrific season
next summer.

Your comment pretty much echoed what we all know and it was well written.

So I bought a new helmet and a Hough book last weekend and I am good to
go, once this friggin snow melts.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
The Older Gentleman
2011-01-11 12:26:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Olson
Post by Calgary (Don)
The fact some people think we are mad for riding bikes period doesn't
make Neil's comment relevant to this discussion. I didn't read where
anyone suggested we should give up riding due to someone else getting
into an accident. I I missed it, my apologies.
I don't think anyone here suggested it, but it was pretty natural to bring
it up as a followup to your posting, as anyone who has ridden for any length
of time has no doubt experienced the same sort of thing.
It was a perfectly logical, natural and relevant reply to a previous
posting made by 'tomorrow'. You know this, I know know this, Calgary
knows this, but he's just (for some reason) trying to kick off a
dispute. Hohum.

I think the only other poster here who castigates people for not
adhering to Post One in any thread is Krusty. Make of that what you
will.
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Triumph Street Triple Honda CB400F
Suzuki TS250 Suzuki GN250 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing damages a machine more than an ignoramus with a manual, a
can-do attitude and a set of cheap tools
schwarzesonne
2011-01-11 12:43:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
I think the only other poster here who castigates people for not
adhering to Post One in any thread is Krusty. Make of that what you
will.
Well, at least I don't have a stick up my ass...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Beav
2011-01-10 12:46:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by ***@erols.com
Having had friends and family killed and other friends and family
permanently disabled, and other friends and family grieviously injured
and then recovered from automobile accidents during my nearly 38 years
of driving, I choose to continue riding and driving my car and truck,
and accept the risks that come with the level of exposure to accident,
injury, and death that comes from all of them.
This is right on the money.
Abso-fucking-lutely. After me and the missus had our spill, I (not really
badly injured, having just a few broken ribs and toes, plus a dislocated
shoulder) went to see her in hospital. She'd (or I'd) managed to fuck her
wrist up to the point where she almost lost her hand, breaking her forearm
into 12 pieces. Her upper arm (humorus) was snapped, her left shoulder
broken and her right shoulder fractured and her jaw damaged by her helmet
strap.

Obviously on the day I went to visit her first, there was no talk of riding
again, but after 7 separate surgeries, 3 bone grafts and countless physio
sessions, she announced that it was "Time to get back to normal" (Ha!:-) and
get the bike out again. She's since decided that she still enjoys bikes so
much that she's getting her own this coming spring. She wants a KTM.
Post by The Older Gentleman
Someone you know dies in a car crash. Do you stop driving?
Or even "Someone you know *doesn't* die in a car crash, do you stop riding
in cars? That's what Britt says to anyone who says "You must be mad" when
they find out she's back riding pillion.
Post by The Older Gentleman
Someone you know dies in a plane crash. Do you stop flying?
There'd be a lot of people self grounded if that was the usual outcome.
Post by The Older Gentleman
Someone you know dies in bed. Do you stop sleeping?
Ahh well, I've almost done that already :-)
--
Beav
Rob Kleinschmidt
2011-01-08 16:30:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Calgary (Don)
So, if I want to continue to travel with my wife (which I do) , and I am
not willing to put my wife to this risk again ( which I am not) then I
have to be very realistic about this when asking myself, Will we ride
again?
No .
I respect anyone's choice, but it seems to me that he and
his wife ought to be making this decision together. Perhaps
he's taking responsibility for choices which are really hers
to make.
Calgary (Don)
2011-01-08 19:47:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rob Kleinschmidt
Post by Calgary (Don)
So, if I want to continue to travel with my wife (which I do) , and I am
not willing to put my wife to this risk again ( which I am not) then I
have to be very realistic about this when asking myself, Will we ride
again?
No .
I respect anyone's choice, but it seems to me that he and
his wife ought to be making this decision together. Perhaps
he's taking responsibility for choices which are really hers
to make.
I'd bet it was discussed.
--
Reeky Ride To The Rockies
http://actualriders.ca/reekyrockies.htm
Road Glidin' Don
2011-01-08 20:06:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rob Kleinschmidt
Post by Calgary (Don)
So, if I want to continue to travel with my wife (which I do) , and I am
not willing to put my wife to this risk again ( which I am not) then I
have to be very realistic about this when asking myself, Will we ride
again?
No .
I respect anyone's choice, but it seems to me that he and
his wife ought to be making this decision together. Perhaps
he's taking responsibility for choices which are really hers
to make.
True. It's rather patronizing, assuming he makes the decisions that
are his wife's to make.

But perhaps he views this akin to two alcoholics living together.
Technically, the decision to continue with the dangerous habit is her
own to make, but his continuing tends to encourage it so, if something
bad results, it's not so hard to see he would be left with a feeling
shared guilt.

To some extent, I suppose that is what I'd have to deal with too, if
my wife were to get badly hurt or killed while riding. It is *her*
decision to make, but I did encourage her to take it up, knowing the
dangers after all. Which is why I have always harped on her to ride
safely and develop the skills necessary for that.

That type of harping (which involves maintaining a mental attitude
that prevents rash decision-making as much as bike-handing skill)
might even be helping her stay safe while on 4-wheels; which is a pay-
off on the other side of the scales not often taken into
consideration.

In addition - although it may seem counter-intuitive if you only think
about the odds of injury per mile ridden - that's why I encouraged her
to get as many miles on her bike as possible each year. Not
progressing past the novice level is what's most dangerous.
The Older Gentleman
2011-01-08 20:11:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Road Glidin' Don
n addition - although it may seem counter-intuitive if you only think
about the odds of injury per mile ridden - that's why I encouraged her
to get as many miles on her bike as possible each year. Not
progressing past the novice level is what's most dangerous.
I tend to draw a parallel with fighter pilots in both world wars. If you
can get past the danger of the very early days, then your chances of
survival improve out of all recognition.
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Triumph Street Triple Honda CB400F
Suzuki TS250 Suzuki GN250 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing damages a machine more than an ignoramus with a manual, a
can-do attitude and a set of cheap tools
schwarzesonne
2011-01-08 20:36:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
I tend to draw a parallel with fighter pilots in both world wars. If you
can get past the danger of the very early days, then your chances of
survival improve out of all recognition.
It must be quite boring to write about FoodNews after being Walter
Mitty in two wars...

---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
Bob Myers
2011-01-08 23:03:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by Road Glidin' Don
n addition - although it may seem counter-intuitive if you only think
about the odds of injury per mile ridden - that's why I encouraged her
to get as many miles on her bike as possible each year. Not
progressing past the novice level is what's most dangerous.
I tend to draw a parallel with fighter pilots in both world wars. If you
can get past the danger of the very early days, then your chances of
survival improve out of all recognition.
I think that's a really good lesson for everyone, as long as no one
takes it to mean that beyond a certain point, you're good enough
to consider yourself invulnerable. Although for most people, I do
believe that it's just the opposite - you start out thinking you're
bulletproof, even though you don't really have a clue what you're
doing, and as time goes on you both get a LOT more skilled AND a
lot more paranoid (in a good way).

I came to motorcycling fairly late, relative to most others - in my
mid-forties - and I think what attracted me was in large part the
same thing I found when I was flying (an avocation I dropped mostly
because the cost of it was way out of proportion to the pleasure I
was getting, which is the exact opposite of what I experience with
a bike): in both pursuits, your safety and well-being is very, very
much completely in your hands. There's always the outside factor
that no degree of skill is going to be able to eliminate (although you
can still do everything you can to prepare yourself for it), but it really
is pretty much all up to you. (A large part of that "all up to you" isn't
just about the skill you exhibit when actually operating the bike, too
- it has to do with whether or not you make the choice to ride in the
first place. If you're too tired, not properly equipped, the bike's in
questionable shape, etc., etc., the decision to not even start out is
also something the experienced rider is a lot more likely to get right.

Bob M.
BryanUT
2011-01-08 23:41:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
Post by Road Glidin' Don
n addition - although it may seem counter-intuitive if you only think
about the odds of injury per mile ridden - that's why I encouraged her
to get as many miles on her bike as possible each year.  Not
progressing past the novice level is what's most dangerous.
I tend to draw a parallel with fighter pilots in both world wars. If you
can get past the danger of the very early days, then your chances of
survival improve out of all recognition.
--
Perhaps. My father survived 30 combat missions out of Thorpe Abbotts
( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Thorpe_Abbotts) in a B17 during
WWII, but he arrived after D-day. Yet on some missions 30% still went
down.

http://www.100bgmus.org.uk/

TOG, if you have the opportunity, please visit this museum, the
caretakers are amazing.

How many of us can say we've stood on the battlefields of our parents.
With our fathers. I have. I am humbled.
schwarzesonne
2011-01-09 03:44:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by BryanUT
How many of us can say we've stood on the battlefields of our parents.
Not you. The Battle of Britain was in 1940, not 1944.
Twibil
2011-01-09 06:40:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by BryanUT
How many of us can say we've stood on the battlefields of our parents.
Not you. The Battle of Britain was in 1940, not 1944.
He said *nothing* about his dad having been in the Battle of Britain,
idiot. In fact, he pointed out that his did didn't even *get* to
England until after D-Day.

Did you think that the Battle of Britain was the end of air combat in
WW2?

Gawd, but you're dumb.
schwarzesonne
2011-01-09 12:41:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Twibil
Gawd, but you're dumb.
Yo, Pete!

Where have you been for the last few days?

Have you been feeling verbally constipated, or what?

Not that verbal constipation is such a bad thing, in your case...
Beav
2011-01-10 13:02:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by Twibil
Gawd, but you're dumb.
Yo, Pete!
Where have you been for the last few days?
Have you been feeling verbally constipated, or what?
Not that verbal constipation is such a bad thing, in your case...
So you couldn't answer the question then? How much of a surprise d'you think
THAT is to anyone?
--
Beav
Twibil
2011-01-11 01:33:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beav
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by Twibil
Gawd, but you're dumb.
Yo, Pete!
Where have you been for the last few days?
Have you been feeling verbally constipated, or what?
Not that verbal constipation is such a bad thing, in your case...
So you couldn't answer the question then? How much of a surprise d'you think
THAT is to anyone?
Whay's hysterical about it is that when I'm happliy chopping his posts
into shreds he whines about it -and accuses me of stalkng him and
being obsessed with him.

Then when I don't....
The Older Gentleman
2011-01-09 16:49:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by BryanUT
How many of us can say we've stood on the battlefields of our parents.
Not you. The Battle of Britain was in 1940, not 1944.
Can't read, can you?
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Triumph Street Triple Honda CB400F
Suzuki TS250 Suzuki GN250 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing damages a machine more than an ignoramus with a manual, a
can-do attitude and a set of cheap tools
Beav
2011-01-10 13:00:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by BryanUT
How many of us can say we've stood on the battlefields of our parents.
Not you. The Battle of Britain was in 1940, not 1944.
You thick cunt. Where does anyone say anything about anyone being in a
particular named battle?

Thank fuck YOU weren't involved in anything important during WWII. Or any
other time, come to that, unless being a prick counts.
--
Beav
schwarzesonne
2011-01-10 20:49:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beav
Thank fuck YOU weren't involved in anything important during WWII. Or any
other time, come to that, unless being a prick counts.
I saved my father's life by being born during WW2, does that count?
Twibil
2011-01-11 01:30:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beav
Thank fuck YOU weren't involved in anything important during WWII.
Actually, we should wish he *had* been, since he would have been
fighting for the Nazis and would therefore have stood a better chance
of ending up dead.
schwarzesonne
2011-01-11 01:47:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Twibil
Post by Beav
Thank fuck YOU weren't involved in anything important during WWII.
Actually, we should wish he *had* been, since he would have been
fighting for the Nazis and would therefore have stood a better chance
of ending up dead.
I would have been *cute* in my little wehrmacht uniform...

Loading Image...

Sieg krusty!
BryanUT
2011-01-11 02:30:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by Twibil
Post by Beav
Thank fuck YOU weren't involved in anything important during WWII.
Actually, we should wish he *had* been, since he would have been
fighting for the Nazis and would therefore have stood a better chance
of ending up dead.
I would have been *cute* in my little wehrmacht uniform...
http://wordsmoker.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/The_baby_Hitler_by_k...
Sieg krusty!
WTF?
tomorrow@erols.com
2011-01-11 04:36:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by Twibil
Post by Beav
Thank fuck YOU weren't involved in anything important during WWII.
Actually, we should wish he *had* been, since he would have been
fighting for the Nazis and would therefore have stood a better chance
of ending up dead.
I would have been *cute* in my little wehrmacht uniform...
http://wordsmoker.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/The_baby_Hitler_by_k...
Sieg krusty!
WTF?
Seems perfectly self-explanatory to me, Bryan.
Twibil
2011-01-09 06:56:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by BryanUT
Post by The Older Gentleman
I tend to draw a parallel with fighter pilots in both world wars. If you
can get past the danger of the very early days, then your chances of
survival improve out of all recognition.
Perhaps. My father survived 30 combat missions out of Thorpe Abbotts
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Thorpe_Abbotts) in a B17 during
WWII, but he arrived after D-day. Yet on some missions 30% still went
down.
That's not what he's talking about, Bryan.

They didn't used to teach air combat the way they do now at the Top
Gun-style fighter pilot schools, and fighter (not bomber) pilots
tended to get shot down in droves on their first few combat missions
because they had no realistic idea of what they had to do in order to
stay alive. (This consisted largely of seeing the enemy fighters -and
reacting to them- before they saw you. Some of the best US fighter
pilots could could not only spot, but could indentify the type and
count the numbers of, an approaching German fighter group whlie it was
still 20 miles distant.)

If fighter pilots survived their first few missions, the odds of their
long-term survival went *way* the heck up; no matter that the missions
themselves were just as dangerous as they'd been before.

This was not true with bomber crews, where hitting the enemy fighters -
or running away- before they could attack *you* simply wasn't an
option.
schwarzesonne
2011-01-09 12:43:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Twibil
They didn't used to teach air combat the way they do now at the Top
Gun-style fighter pilot schools (snip logorrhea)
How come you Experts on Everything can talk about economics and air
combat training and everything else under the sun but you can't tell a
newbie why his motorcycle won't start?
The Older Gentleman
2011-01-09 16:49:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by Twibil
They didn't used to teach air combat the way they do now at the Top
Gun-style fighter pilot schools (snip logorrhea)
How come you Experts on Everything can talk about economics and air
combat training and everything else under the sun but you can't tell a
newbie why his motorcycle won't start?
From the poster who declared he knew all about air combat from a flight
sim :-))
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Triumph Street Triple Honda CB400F
Suzuki TS250 Suzuki GN250 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing damages a machine more than an ignoramus with a manual, a
can-do attitude and a set of cheap tools
Twibil
2011-01-09 19:47:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
How come you Experts on Everything can talk about economics and air
combat training and everything else under the sun but you can't tell a
newbie why his motorcycle won't start?
(A) Didn't you know? An intelligent person tries to do *all* the
things he does just as well as he can do them.

(B) An intelligent person is scrupulously honest with himself -which
leaves you out- and knows exactly where his strengths lie.....and
where they do not.

(C) But even so, you might have a point there if only *you* could tell
someone why their motorcycle won't start.

But you can't. All you can do is Wiki and Google.

You know far less about bikes than I -as your hilarious scew-ups have
proven literally dozens of times- and I am self-admittedly not a
mechanical genius: simply because it doesn't interest me.
The Older Gentleman
2011-01-09 19:53:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Twibil
C) But even so, you might have a point there if only *you* could tell
someone why their motorcycle won't start.
Q: Why won't my motorycle start?

A: Because you listened to Krusty and ripped out the ignition system ;-)
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Triumph Street Triple Honda CB400F
Suzuki TS250 Suzuki GN250 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing damages a machine more than an ignoramus with a manual, a
can-do attitude and a set of cheap tools
Twibil
2011-01-09 19:59:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
Q: Why won't my motorycle start?
A: Because you listened to Krusty and ripped out the ignition system ;-)
Hee.

Well-played.
schwarzesonne
2011-01-09 21:08:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Older Gentleman
A: Because you
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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tomorrow@erols.com
2011-01-09 22:17:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands.
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Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands. ...
You sure do talk about yourself a lot.
Beav
2011-01-10 13:05:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@erols.com
Post by schwarzesonne
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands. ...
You sure do talk about yourself a lot.
We didn't really need to listen to the whole thing twice though :-)
--
Beav
tomorrow@erols.com
2011-01-11 01:35:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Beav
Post by ***@erols.com
Post by schwarzesonne
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands. ...
You sure do talk about yourself a lot.
We didn't really need to listen to the whole thing twice though :-)
Point.
Twibil
2011-01-09 23:00:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­-----------------------------------
Nothing damages a newsgroup more than an egomaniac with an attitude,
an
agenda, a keyboard and lots of time on his hands. (X60)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------­----------------------------------
Your only problem here is that no matter how many times you add zero
to zero you're *still* going to be a zero.

It's the story of your life.
schwarzesonne
2011-01-09 21:05:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Twibil
You know far less about bikes than I -as your hilarious scew-ups have
proven literally dozens of times- and I am self-admittedly not a
mechanical genius: simply because it doesn't interest me.
Let's put it another way then.

Where have all the newbies gone?

Why don't the newbies ask all you self styled experts how to get their
motorcycles running anymore?

Could it be that you guys have outlived your usefulness?
tomorrow@erols.com
2011-01-09 22:18:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Where have all the newbies gone?
Since you can find no one here to benefit from your vast knowledge and
helpful advice, you may now run along.
Road Glidin' Don
2011-01-09 23:27:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by schwarzesonne
Post by Twibil
You know far less about bikes than I -as your hilarious scew-ups have
proven literally dozens of times- and I am self-admittedly not a
mechanical genius: simply because it doesn't interest me.
Let's put it another way then.
Where have all the newbies gone?
Why don't the newbies ask all you self styled experts how to get their
motorcycles running anymore?
1. Because use of usenet (in general) is trailing off

and

2. Because those that do come are turned off by racists and those
obsessed with the subject of homosexuality, like yourself.
The Older Gentleman
2011-01-09 16:49:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by BryanUT
Post by The Older Gentleman
I tend to draw a parallel with fighter pilots in both world wars. If you
can get past the danger of the very early days, then your chances of
survival improve out of all recognition.
--
Perhaps. My father survived 30 combat missions out of Thorpe Abbotts
( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Thorpe_Abbotts) in a B17 during
WWII, but he arrived after D-day. Yet on some missions 30% still went
down.
Bomber pilots were a different kettle of fish. For most, it was blind
luck whether you were shot down or not. There wasn't much in the way of
skill you could acquire to fight back.
Post by BryanUT
http://www.100bgmus.org.uk/
TOG, if you have the opportunity, please visit this museum, the
caretakers are amazing.
You know, I will, thanks. I'd never heard of it before.
--
BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Triumph Street Triple Honda CB400F
Suzuki TS250 Suzuki GN250 chateaudotmurrayatidnetdotcom
Nothing damages a machine more than an ignoramus with a manual, a
can-do attitude and a set of cheap tools
Vito
2011-01-08 21:16:13 UTC
Permalink
"Calgary (Don)" <actual.rider******@telus.net> wrote
|I had mentioned a couple of times a friend of mine and his wife had an
| animal impact accident in Vermont last summer. I know Bob (6ft6) has
| been wrestling with the question of will he, or should he ever ride
| again. Today Bob posted the following to a local forum. It is an
| interesting read.
|
| ******************
| 6ft6
| The last “real thing” I remember ......|
| I said “real thing” because I also recall many strange things ....

FWIW I had a friend who T-boned a pick up truck some years ago and also
recalled many strange things happening while comatose. He imagined that he
had been captured by some So. American militia and tortured. He eventually
learned that the "torture" was really his treatments and the restraints were
merely to keep him from farther injury. He too said that his dreams were
far more real to him than reality. Our minds work in strange ways. Thanks
for sharing ...
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